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6

The warmer the fermentation (to a reasonable point) the more active the yeast is and the less diacetyl you'll get. To do a diacetyl rest for an ale, you just leave it on the yeast longer. It's not the temp that matters for a d rest. You raise the temp for lagers in order to make the yeast more active, but the actual temp (again, within reason) doesn't ...


5

NEVER use bubbling as a measure of anything important. You MUST take actual gravity readings to know where your fermentation is. As a general rule, you should do a diacytl rest when you are about 70-80% done with fermentation. So for a "normal" strength lager (1.050-1.060 OG) I'll start the diacytl rest when the beer hits about the 1.020-1.022 range ...


4

You can always take a gravity reading and taste the beer to determine if you even need to do a diacetyl rest. When you raise the temps on a lager for a diacetyl rest, the purpose is to make the yeast more active in order to reduce the diacetyl. Even if the yeast is less active, giving it more time accomplishes the same thing. That's true of ales, too. ...


4

WY2206 is my go to lager yeast and I've used it many times. It almost never throws diacetyl if you do a long enough fermentation. I never pitch a lager at temps higher than 45F, and then keep the fermentation temp around 50ish. I give it 3-4 weeks in primary, then take a gravity reading and taste the beer. If I taste diacetyl, I raise the temp for a ...


4

"Sweet almost caramel-like flavor" doesn't sound like diacetyl to me. Diacetyl is "buttery," and is hard to get in normal Ale fermentations unless you are using a yeast strain known for it. (Ringwood, I think is noted for it?) What yeast did you use, and at what temps? I would attribute "sweet/caramel" flavors in your first batch to more likely be "extract ...


4

Bottom cropping yeasts are easier to rouse out of dormancy with higher temps than top cropping yeasts. I'd say that, even now, warming the fermenter up to 58 for the diacetyl rest would be totally appropriate and doable. I don't know that the time component is really important, unless it'd been so long that all the yeast was dead, and I don't think that's ...


3

Give your lager a nice long fermentation (say 4 weeks) with plenty of healthy yeast and it's unlikely you'll need a diacetyl rest. I typically take a gravity reading after 4 weeks and taste the sample. If there is diacetyl, I do the rest at that point. If I don't taste it, it doesn't need the rest. BTW, I don't think the yeast will necessarily be ...


3

It should be fairly easy to determine the actual temperatures your fridge stays at. Fill a bucket with water & put a thermometer in it. It doesn't have to be five gallons, two or three will do. The more water, the longer you must wait during step 3. Turn the fridge to the warmest setting and put the bucket in it. Allow the temperature to stabilize – ...


3

There's a science behind these suggestions (explained by eg Noonan in "New Brewing Lager"). I prefer to perform forced diacetyl test before i decide to warm up fermenting beer. For my past German lagers this was enough (fermented with Bohemian Lager, Munich Lager and Bavarian Lager yeast). And i always pitch cold, at 8-9*C.


3

Traditional German brewers would use a krausen from an actively fermenting batch to carbonate and this would also reabsorb the diacetyl. You can do the same thing by priming and pitching a pack of yeast and the secondary fermentation should do the trick. A diacetyl rest at this point will not effective since there is very little active yeast in the beer ...


3

What you describe is exactly what I do. I move my fermenter from the basement (~50°F) to the study (~70°F) and leave it for 2-3 days before racking it to a keg for the lagering fridge. Since primary fermentation is done and most of the sugar has already been metabolized, there's little or no danger of creating estery off-flavors from the higher fermentation ...


2

Those temps are not a problem at all for a d rest.


2

Do you actually have diacetyl? Ringwood is a known diacetyl producer, so you should expect to, but nothing beats actually detecting it. :) For an ale, you should be able to just leave the beer at fermentation temps, and the yeast will keep working to clean up any diacetyl they've produced. If it were a lager, you'd want to raise up to ~68°F with a few ...


2

I would do it later rather than earlier. By raising the temperature early, you risk introducing esters, fusels and sulphur compounds into the beer, which can't be cleaned up easily. Traditionally the diacetyl rest is done after primary, not during it. (see reference below.) So you should be fine just leaving the beer. When you get home from your trip, take ...


2

I'm not speaking from experience here, since I don't brew sours, but the yeast should reabsorb the diacetyl, just as it does in a regular ferment. The yeast will convert diacetyl into acetoin then 2,3-butanediol, which has much higher taste threshold than diacetyl. Both conversions provide energy, and so help sustain the yeast when other energy sources are ...


2

The warmer temperature should not make this problem worse. I'd let it sit for up to 48 hours and taste it again. I wouldn't bottle yet. Bottling (and conditioning in general) helps many beers but you'll waste 12 ounces at a time just to taste if you bottle it now.


1

You may have picked the wrong yeast. I read somewhere I think it was from Wyeast, that all yeasts produce Diacetyl, but some yeasts are better than others at cleaning it up. So whenever Wyeast recommends a 'Diacetyl rest' for a strain, you should not use it to clean up Diacetyl. Instead I would pick a non English yeast that does not require a D-rest, which ...


1

Being that it's a sour and you pitched bacteria, it's entirely possible that the diacetyl is a result of your purposeful "infection". I don't think there are any guarantees, but I do think it's possible that it will be at least somewhat reduced by the yeast.


1

You may not need a d rest at all, so in that case you'd be OK. I only do a d rest when I actually taste diacetyl in the beer and that doesn't happen often. The purpose of a d rest is to make the yeast more active so they'll consume dicaetyl. Obviously, that would work better in primary where there's more yeast, but there should still be enough yeast in ...


1

IMO, a week isn't too long. But I question whether you actually need a d rest. Can you taste diacetyl? If not, you don't need the rest.


1

A couple of follow up questions: 1.) as the poster above says, the recipe would help. Sometimes it is difficult for yeast to metabolize the some of the sugars in extract syrups that haven't been fully converted to consumable monosaccharides. 2.) Just a thought: did you add your extract to your water when your heat source was fired? That can cause ...


1

My interpretation of a "diacetyl rest" is to simply to leave your beer in the fermentor for a number of days (~2-3?) at 65F after you have achieved constant FG readings. This will allow remaining suspended yeast to remove residual diacetyl which is probably not what you want for your beer style. Since this won't harm your beer in any way, you mind as well ...


1

I do not have personal experience, but I have researched HERMS systems. This article may help: http://sdcollins.home.mindspring.com/HERMS.html This author seems to think that claims of temperature change significantly greater than 1 degree/minute are probably not true and may be disingenuous.


1

I usually take that to mean "hold the temperature at its high point for an extra day or three after the fermentation activity has mostly stopped" (i.e. don't let it peak and fall back down too quickly).


1

Are you sure there isn't another issue here as to why you're getting off flavors? I've lagered in my primary for 3 weeks before without experiencing any diacetyl. If anything I would think letting your brew rest on the yeast cake would help clear out even more diacetyl. From what I understand, autolysis takes at least a month to occur, even longer at ...


1

Based on my own experience, a week is fine. If you use enough good healthy yeast and give your beer a long primary, a d rest is unnecessary almost all the time.



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